Strike Systems

[Jumpscare]

Same. If I have to talk to someone twice about the same misbehavior, they’re gone.

Some people can change. Others can’t. If they need more than one warning, they’re more than likely in the latter category. And it’s a better use of my time to RP with trusted regulars than to try to help a chronic problem player.

[Third Eye]

@Jenn said in Strike Systems:

Like. If you’re one of those places with an activity requirement? Then yeah, some strikes are better than a perma-ban because someone’s kid got ill and they couldn’t make the one scene a week minimum. Aside - thank eff we got rid of that ish for the most part.

Getting banned for not meeting an activity requirement seems very extreme. What game did this happen on? Is it still up? I’d love to read this policy.

[Jenn]

@Third-Eye

Couldn’t tell you. Read it in policies, knew it would be a bad fit. Didn’t continue reading or app anything.

[Juniper]

I’ve staffed in places (outside of RP) that had strike systems and I think it was more because that was the done thing in gaming culture, rather than any deliberate and conscientious design.

It didn’t work. People get really mad if they’re given a strike they feel they didn’t deserve, it becomes a technicality and a debate-magnet. Also, we were a bunch of immature teenagers.

Growing up is realising you can just talk to people instead of issuing ultimatums from your ivory tower.

[Roz]

Back in the day of three strike rules, I remember giving what felt like endless WARNINGS before even getting to the first strike.

It was a bad system.

[SockMonkey]

@Juniper I had someone once explain it to me as “If you wouldn’t invite them into your living room why would you invite them into your game?” Whether it’s a game, a scene, or whatever. The same concept remains.

My in person friendships get a lot more grace and chances. I’ve also had online friendships get to the point of earning those chances because of my history with the person.

Boundaries aren’t bad (whether as staff or player) though especially for people you don’t know outside of a game and who haven’t put in the effort to receive additional chances.

Giving someone you hardly know, who has shown a negative behavior, the continued chance to add to your stress and the stress of those around you?

I’m a hypocrite sometimes though and still have trouble having a spine. The older I get though? The less fucks I give.

[SockMonkey]

@Roz Yet no matter how many warnings or strikes you give the banhammer always comes “out of nowhere” -_-

[Roz]

@SockMonkey I NEVER EVEN GOT TO BAN ANYONE

[SockMonkey]

@Roz

[sao]

@Roz yeah we REALLY should have banned some people. We put ourselves through a lot of toxic nonsense in the effort to both be fair and appear fair, and the people we should have banned and didn’t did not actually benefit.

[Rucket]

Looking at the current state of reality, my tolerance for bullshit is at an all time low. At this point if I ran a game and someone spoke some right wing shit id ban them. I think a lot of issues have persisted because people have wanted to be nice or polite. Sometimes it’s just best for everyone to just move on without them.

[Juniper]

@Rucket said in Strike Systems:

At this point if I ran a game and someone spoke some right wing shit id ban them.

Amen to that.

“A-bloo-boo-hoo, freedom of speech, blah blah”
Nah. Go away. I’m tired of playing how far they can boil the frog before there’s a problem.

[Gashlycrumb]

@Rucket I had this rule in the 20-teens and would absolutely do it again. I don’t remember banning anybody for bigoty hatredy shit, but I had to be reminded that I banned somebody for attempted IC kiddy-diddling. There were no strikes, people were expected to read the rules, there is some shit I will not eat., it was clear, and I’m not in the business of potty training, we’re here to have fun and make friends.

[MisterBoring]

@SockMonkey said in Strike Systems:

“If you wouldn’t invite them into your living room why would you invite them into your game?”

I can also think of people that I regularly invite to my living room that I would never invite to a MU I was running. They’re wonderful people, but tend to try and hog the spotlight in RP.

[SockMonkey]

@MisterBoring True! Granted, I’m a hobbit and keep to myself so it’s less literal for me too. It still helped put things into perspective as far as why I’d bend over backwards to accommodate someone online when I wouldn’t do that irl.

[Tez]

@Roz

[somasatori]

@Jumpscare said in Strike Systems:

Some people can change. Others can’t.

Man, at this point I’m willing to believe that we’re all pretty firmly set in our behavioral ways when it comes to MUSHing and would argue that most, if not all, people in the hobby will resist changing. This might be due to my WoD-brain. It seems like the vast majority of the WoD MUSH sphere of influence has operated with deeply flawed and bad actors for such a long time that there’s this assumption that having the worst possible personality traits manifest and cause problems are just part of the hobby.

Look at any recent shitty MUSH drama and you’ll see ghosts of the past in there. Recently I saw a game give a lot of chances to a player that multiple people insisted was different, had changed, etc., when they were up the same old shit in private. From overstepping boundaries to people on weird narcissistic power trips to people attempting to manipulate others for their own personal gain, it’s this long series of intergenerational MUSH trauma that’s persisted. And not to be a doomer, but it will likely persist until the end of the hobby because there’s this psychological ecosystem that provides a kind of parasocial and quasi-social connection where very emotionally abused people think this kind of behavior is normal from your text-based friends.

[Yam]

@somasatori said in Strike Systems:

@Jumpscare said in Strike Systems:

Some people can change. Others can’t.

Man, at this point I’m willing to believe that we’re all pretty firmly set in our behavioral ways when it comes to MUSHing and would argue that most, if not all, people in the hobby will resist changing.

I’m inclined to agree. I’m curious if anyone has actually legitimately witnessed a fundamental change in someone with regards to MUSH behavior, perhaps due to some fallout, maybe in the form of banning or lost friends.

[Muscle Car]

@somasatori They’re institutionalized. I remember being shocked that Sun introduced back into Lib three prior problem players, telling us on public channels to “give them a chance,” and being more shocked how it was just accepted (and dissent coldly shut down). All three players raised hell after a couple weeks of playing nice. At some point it becomes engineered failure.

There are some people who only feel at home in conflict and feel alienated in places of sense and order, so they manufacture conflict in order to feel in their element. Players and staff can succumb to it, but when it’s a lifestyle, not an accident, there’s little to be done but find greener pastures or a new means to enjoy the hobby.

[Ashkuri]

@Yam said in Strike Systems:

I’m curious if anyone has actually legitimately witnessed a fundamental change in someone with regards to MUSH behavior

I have encountered:

• People behaving very differently to me from one game to another game, in that the game structures and communities themselves brought out the best or worst of that person
• People making a big effort to change their toxic MU behavior after fucking up so bad that they realized they need to get their house in order. This would probably be the ‘lost friends’ or fallout aspect you mentioned above
• People who went on mental health medication and/or therapy and as a result developed more community-friendly and cooperative patterns in their MU spaces