Suspected Superhero Creeping Or Something

[Tez]

@Pavel said in DWOPP-spotting:

@Snackness isn’t at fault, in my view, as they were simply passing the message along.

Totally agree. I appreciate the reblog. So to speak.

[GF]

@IoleRae said in DWOPP-spotting:

Yes. It has been established explicitly that they are not. That does not in any way, shape, or form mean that the accusation wasn’t made, or that it removes the right of that person to talk about it.

I agree with this. I suppose where I’m disconnected from you is, I do not think Lithium is DWOPP or that anyone should think he is. I consider that matter settled, to a degree that it kind of confuses me anyone could still think that’s the issue at play here rather than how he has treated multiple people (I thought I only knew four, but more have come out of the woodwork to tell me their stories in the last few hours).

That is the lens I am viewing this conflict through. To me, this has nothing to do with mistaken identity. To me, it’s about his defense echoing the behaviors that got people thinking in the first place he would not be safe to be around. Do you disagree?

[sao]

also, I swear I remember Lithium being not a male identifying person, I apologize if that’s not correct, but please let’s not misgender people while we are talking about ways they may or may not be shitty

[Coin]

@Runescryer said in DWOPP-spotting:

@Coin Pattern Recognition is kind of speculation. I don’t need to know that the 18-wheeler a few cars ahead of me slamming on it’s brakes is going to crash before swerving to avoid something that might not happen.

And, yes. It’s because it was speculation that I didn’t mention names or locations as of yet. I was giving a general warning, specifically for a possible DWOPP return, but also as a general ‘watch your games because we’ve got an active creeper’. ZG stepped forward with the identity of the game; Lithium outed themselves when nobody was directly accusing him. I feel confident in trying to maintain as much annominity of those involved as possible. If Lithium hadn’t made his public protest, I would have accepted the results of ZG’s investigation and said “The person in question isn’t DWOPP, but is still showing signs of toxic behavior,” and kept the general warning.

Trying to paint Lithium owning up to being the person your speculating was about as a bad thing is pretty hilarious, man. In any actual rationale, it’s a good thing and a mark in their favor (evidenced by both Roz and IoleRae pointing out they don’t like Lithium but that Lithium doesn’t look all that bad in all this).

Just as an aside, because I went to look, because it’s my home office day and I’m fucking bored,

This is probably what Warren was referring to when he said ‘bragging about banging Tony’ (I assume Jean told him about this conversation, I dunno, broken telephone is a staple of MU life).

Just as an aside, I’m been informed that the ‘old modeling friend’ of Betsy’s was Pepper Potts, which would be just fine. Except both Betsy and Pepper were played by Macha. She set herself up for a blind date with her boss.

LOL. I don’t even care, don’t even think it’s ‘unethical’ or anything, I just find it funny.

[IoleRae]

In case I was unclear in my shit losing (it may have happened on occasion), I do not at all object to Snackness boosting/posting here. I don’t think that was problematic in the slightest. I think it was great and valuable and anyone thinking of doing a thing like that next time should 100% do it.

[Testament]

@Pavel said in DWOPP-spotting:

It’s basic sense, and you’re all supposed to be adults.

Hey now, that’s assuming a lot here.

[tsar]

@Coin said in DWOPP-spotting:

Just as an aside, I’m been informed that the ‘old modeling friend’ of Betsy’s was Pepper Potts, which would be just fine. Except both Betsy and Pepper were played by Macha. She set herself up for a blind date with her boss.

Ooof.

[Pavel]

@Coin said in DWOPP-spotting:

I don’t even care, don’t even think it’s ‘unethical’ or anything

I do. I fucking hate alt-crossing more than political conversations.

[GF]

@IoleRae said in DWOPP-spotting:

In case I was unclear in my shit losing (it may have happened on occasion), I do not at all object to Snackness boosting/posting here. I don’t think that was problematic in the slightest. I think it was great and valuable and anyone thinking of doing a thing like that next time should 100% do it.

I think that was all very clear. If I am reading you right, you’re angry about the injustice of seeing someone bullied into accepting responsibility for a crime they didn’t commit: being DWOPP.

[Coin]

@Pavel said in DWOPP-spotting:

@Coin said in DWOPP-spotting:

I don’t even care, don’t even think it’s ‘unethical’ or anything

I do. I fucking hate alt-crossing more than political conversations.

I mean, I get it. I just started in a different culture where that sort of thing was okay because it was transparent and part of the way everyone told cohesive, joint stories.

It’s a preference, and a hill I don’t particularly feel the need to die on.

[tsar]

I guess it depends on the context for me. If it’s harmless fluff, it’s fine. Whatever.

If it’s someone trying to set my PC up with another PC and I find out that someone is playing both characters, oof. Or I find out they’re trying to engineer a situation where they’re manipulating me for their alt’s benefit at all without telling me, oof.

[IoleRae]

@GF said in DWOPP-spotting:

@IoleRae said in DWOPP-spotting:

Yes. It has been established explicitly that they are not. That does not in any way, shape, or form mean that the accusation wasn’t made, or that it removes the right of that person to talk about it.

I agree with this. I suppose where I’m disconnected from you is, I do not think Lithium is DWOPP or that anyone should think he is. I consider that matter settled, to a degree that it kind of confuses me anyone could still think that’s the issue at play here rather than how he has treated multiple people (I thought I only knew four, but more have come out of the woodwork to tell me their stories in the last few hours).

My disconnect here is that I don’t get to decide that the matter is settled for the person that had the accusation leveled against them, you don’t, nobody does but them. It’s an absolutely terrible thing to say about somebody that automatically gets the emotions up and going.

I was nearly incoherent in response to the Hobos shit, and there was no genuine threat of anybody believing a damn thing that he said. I was safe. I didn’t FEEL safe, but I was safe.

It would be hypocritical of me to not demand the same space for somebody else just because I don’t like them.

That is the lens I am viewing this conflict through. To me, this has nothing to do with mistaken identity. To me, it’s about his defense echoing the behaviors that got people thinking in the first place he would not be safe to be around. Do you disagree?

Yes, I do. I am not seeing the defense echoing the behaviors here. I AM seeing somebody that I do not like have an emotional reaction to nastiness, but I do not see anything abusive to it.

Maybe that would be different were I privy to somebody’s discord conversations, but I have been on the receiving end of Macha trying to make me interpret somebody else’s behavior as terrible before, so.

[Runescryer]

@Pavel I agree. And again…where did I say anything more than 'DWOPP might be back again," without naming names and locations? Where did I give a clue of the player in question or the game before ZG and Lithium spoke up?

If we can’t even give a general ‘heads up’ while actively keeping names and locations out of the conversation, then what’s even the point of trying to warn the community of potentially toxic behavior. You’re giving the abuser what they need: time to embed themselves further for whatever purpose is their goal.

Toxic behavior was observed. Staff was alerted. The community was alerted to be on guard, like a neighborhood being warned that someone’s house was broken into and the police are investigating. No names were disclosed. The investigation was allowed to proceed and was concluded.

Bottom line: I will never make an accusation of ‘so-and-so is doing this…’ without proof. I accept that not everyone is going to interpret POV the same way, which is why I try to give a ‘heads up’ while things are still being investigated by Staff.

Or would you rather that everyone just stay silent and ignore the potential of someone acting sus and letting them keep doing what they’re doing?

[Coin]

@tsar said in DWOPP-spotting:

I guess it depends on the context for me. If it’s harmless fluff, it’s fine. Whatever.

If it’s someone trying to set my PC up with another PC and I find out that someone is playing both characters, oof. Or I find out they’re trying to engineer a situation where they’re manipulating me for their alt’s benefit at all without telling me, oof.

Right. Transparency is key in these situations.

To be clear: I do not think Runescryer/Tony was ignorant of this at all.

[tsar]

@Coin said in DWOPP-spotting:

@tsar said in DWOPP-spotting:

I guess it depends on the context for me. If it’s harmless fluff, it’s fine. Whatever.

If it’s someone trying to set my PC up with another PC and I find out that someone is playing both characters, oof. Or I find out they’re trying to engineer a situation where they’re manipulating me for their alt’s benefit at all without telling me, oof.

Right. Transparency is key in these situations.

To be clear: I do not think Runescryer/Tony was ignorant of this at all.

Good point, thanks for the clarification. I’m losing track of all these superhero alts.

[Pavel]

@tsar Yeah, if it’s harmless then I’ll probably not even notice. But I like a very strong clear distinction between character and player knowledge, which is all the harder when you’ve got all your alts RPing with the same character.

And it’s rife for this kind of bullshit.

@Runescryer said in DWOPP-spotting:

while actively keeping names and locations out of the conversation

Except you didn’t keep names out. You specifically mentioned DWOPP. You didn’t give a general creeper warning, you specifically called one specific predator out by name.

[Tez]

@Runescryer said in DWOPP-spotting:

Toxic behavior was observed.

I think this is where people are waiting with signs that say CITATION NEEDED.

[Coin]

@Tez said in DWOPP-spotting:

@Runescryer said in DWOPP-spotting:

Toxic behavior was observed.

I think this is where people are waiting with signs that say CITATION NEEDED.

[Selira]

@Runescryer The thing is, you proudly touted that you “HAD RECEIPTS” and made a big deal out of it, and then when you brought it out, what it looked like was you going “this character was mean to my character so this guy is a creep :(”

Frankly, I don’t think anybody looks good here, this is some of the most asinine drama to hit, but you were the one who went immediately “THIS MIGHT BE DWOPP” and stirred up that possibility. The person wasn’t. You jumped to one of the worst possible conclusions because … you didn’t like a potential way the story might go, because of a private scene?

and lord, we all know what I think of Lithium. I fully expect ZG had their reasons for the bans, and that they were based off of patterns of behavior. But you made a very specific accusation and then your evidence sucked.

[Pavel]

@Runescryer said in DWOPP-spotting:

The community was alerted to be on guard, like a neighborhood being warned that someone’s house was broken into and the police are investigating. No names were disclosed. The investigation was allowed to proceed and was concluded.

Just to reiterate the main thrust of my point: That’s not what you did. You warned the neighbourhood that Charles Manson might be the one breaking into the houses.

The thread you started is actually titled “The All-New Down With OPP Thread.”