What stops you from running a game?

[Jumpscare]

@Tat said in What stops you from running a game?:

If the answer is ‘code’, can you break down what the code barriers are?

For me, coding takes a very long time. It gives me headaches. I’m up to 25,000 lines of code, so it’s getting difficult to keep track of.

When the pandemic started, I thought it would be fun to try to figure out how to make a MU*. I envisioned that it’d be something I’d break within a month and toss into the trash. I’m not a coder. The fact that the game isn’t collapsing under its own weight after 2 years of my amateur coding ability is something I’m still confused about.

I just have to get this last 15% of the game coded and then I’ll finally be done… with coding.

I still have the building tasks of writing rooms, items, and NPCs, few of which are in the game at this time. There’s also the website and webclient. I could leave the game with a default Evennia template, but that feels so unthemely.

I’m going to need a break after all that, or I’ll have burned out before I can ST a single scene.

Making and running a game is an incredible undertaking which requires such a broad set of skills that a single person shouldn’t be expected to have. If I could turn back time, I’d tell myself to just make a default AresMUSH installation and call it a day, haha.

That being said, this process has been as fun as it has been foolish. I think the end result will be worth it, if at the very least for the self satisfaction of saying, “I made a game.”

[BloodAngel]

Well there we go, this thread inspired me to throw my hat into the ring. Let us see if anything does come of it.

[Jumpscare]

@BloodAngel See you in two years.

[L. B. Heuschkel]

@Tat said in What stops you from running a game?:

Are there any small plugins you really want? Something like magic is big and real real complicated, but I am curious whether there are any smaller plugins that would benefit a lot of people.

I’m trying to do the mind mapping of how a magic ‘currency’ might work – not an actual currency but a means to track the use of, say, crafted items and potions. It seems a necessary foundation before you even consider the actual crafting system – otherwise, a player will rack up several hundred magic thingies.

I’ve seen one game – yours, I think? – that used Luck as such a currency. I’m leaning towards maybe some kind of merit point also earned from scening.

It’s all very complicated. The biggest complication, probably, is that every game setting is likely to want its own take – and hence, the code needs to be extremely customisable.

[Testament]

@Tat said in What stops you from running a game?:

@L-B-Heuschkel said in What stops you from running a game?:

I do think that as time passes, more and more plugins are published, we’ll see more and more small games that don’t require a full code staff. This is a Good Thing.

Are there any small plugins you really want? Something like magic is big and real real complicated, but I am curious whether there are any smaller plugins that would benefit a lot of people.

I think a lot of people would love a generalized magic system plugin, but like you say, it would be a massive undertaking. And how would you even standardize something like that? What metrics would you go by in order to create something that could be considered a template while allowing for customization?

I’ve thought about this for awhile, but nothing has truly stood out to me in order to make that work.

[BloodAngel]

@Jumpscare Thank you. I have most of the lore and world built out and the plots. Been working on it for a few years, but the issue is I can’t code. I have Thenomain’s code loaded up on a server, but can’t do much with it. I have tried to figure out and smoke comes out of my ears like a cartoon.

[L. B. Heuschkel]

@Testament said in What stops you from running a game?:

I think a lot of people would love a generalized magic system plugin, but like you say, it would be a massive undertaking. And how would you even standardize something like that? What metrics would you go by in order to create something that could be considered a template while allowing for customization?

Where I’m at, I am thinking some kind of basic ‘currency’ – let’s call them merit points, whatever. You need to be able to specify how they are earned – from scenes, automatic over time, what’s your preference?

Then you need to determine what they do. For a crafting system, each point might equate to owning or creating and owning a magic thingamajic – a weapon enchantment, a spell, a magical potion, whatevs.

When the thing is spent, the point is used.

But, and here is the tricky thing – any implementation of such a system would require

• a decision how merit is created
• whether stats affect it and how
• all enchantments, spells, potions, you name them, needing implementation with FS3 support

And that last one is, quite frankly, a killer.

[Paradox]

@L-B-Heuschkel

I’m curious if this is with the intent to be used with the automated combat systems? Since otherwise wouldn’t everything be just on the narrative side?

[Tat]

@L-B-Heuschkel said in What stops you from running a game?:

I’ve seen one game – yours, I think? – that used Luck as such a currency. I’m leaning towards maybe some kind of merit point also earned from scening.

It did, yeah – sort of, anyway. There’s a real simple inventory plugin that does the same, but it doesn’t have any crafting attached and I’m not sure it does the ‘tracking’ you want, but it might be worth a look as a starting place.

[L. B. Heuschkel]

@Paradox said in What stops you from running a game?:

@L-B-Heuschkel

I’m curious if this is with the intent to be used with the automated combat systems? Since otherwise wouldn’t everything be just on the narrative side?

I am thinking in terms of FS3 implementation, yes. It’s a hell of a lot easier if you ‘only’ do narrative.

[L. B. Heuschkel]

@Tat said in What stops you from running a game?:

@L-B-Heuschkel said in What stops you from running a game?:

I’ve seen one game – yours, I think? – that used Luck as such a currency. I’m leaning towards maybe some kind of merit point also earned from scening.

It did, yeah – sort of, anyway. There’s a real simple inventory plugin that does the same, but it doesn’t have any crafting attached and I’m not sure it does the ‘tracking’ you want, but it might be worth a look as a starting place.

Yeah. I’m actually looking at it and have been for a bit. Thinking maybe I can hack it together with the Advantages system that also exists, and come up with some kind of useful hybrid. In time. because again, I am not a great coder. XD

[Paradox]

@L-B-Heuschkel

I think that’s always been my ‘hiccup’ as it were in regards to the FS3 automation vs. anything else.

If you want to keep the tasty combat in, you are really handcuffed in what you can do. Otherwise, it’s far less restrictive.

Take for example even the simplicity of adding a ‘bonus’ to your actions based on a BG skill in FS3 automated combat.

[L. B. Heuschkel]

@Paradox said in What stops you from running a game?:

Take for example even the simplicity of adding a ‘bonus’ to your actions based on a BG skill in FS3 automated combat.

Yeah. FS3 allows it all. I do these things manually when running FS3 combat. But to automate them – well, that takes a level of comfort with rooting around in FS3’s code that I don’t have. Yet.

[Testament]

For what I’m doing, I actually took a lot of inspiration from Savage Skies on h ow they handled their magic system, as I think it was a pretty good one. Granted, I didn’t and still don’t have it all implemented.

I turned the different ‘schools’ of magic into Advantages, and based on the level of Advantage you had, is the level of complexity of spells you could cast. This is the point where I brought in certain aspects of DnD, such as Cantrips, miniscule stuff that you could caste repeated without issue. Actual spells you had a certain number of times that could be casted.

The unwieldy part, and I realize it’s unwieldy, is that some spells could only be used ‘outside of combat’ because there was no way that they could be implemented into FS3. At least, not that I know of. A limitation of FS3 is you can’t buff your teammates en masse, but you can debuff opposing NPCs.

That’s where I decided until I could figure out something better, that we just work with rolling everything out. This works, but I know it’s not the most elegant way of sorting it out. It works, but I’d like to improve it.

[Third Eye]

@lucidmaus said in What stops you from running a game?:

Laziness, for me.

Same. Also there are things I could learn but don’t enjoy (minimal dealing with code to install stuff and keep it maintained), and also things that can very quickly turn into a grind (OOC player management). Nothing that can’t be overcome if you’re into it but there are stretches of time when I just don’t want to deal with the demands of the treadmill and even when you’re just staffing it’s hard to entirely check out, let alone running the show.

[Jumpscare]

@BloodAngel I’m not versed on Thenomain’s codebase, but I think the first thing I’d ask any aspiring game creator is, “What part of your game do you want to make that can’t already be made with AresMUSH?”

And then I’d suggest taking that list of features and trying to make them fit into the AresMUSH guidelines. And lastly, I’d suggest asking the AresMUSH community for how to do the things that remain on your list.

In my opinion, Evennia and AresMUSH can do almost the exact same things, except you get more customization out of Evennia and more ease-of-use out of AresMUSH. If you have a setting and just want to run scenes on the web with other players, AresMUSH is ideal. If you want any of a traditional grid, in-game secrets, NPC AI, or automated combat, Evennia is probably the better choice. There are plenty of other choices out there, but those two appear to be emerging as the two modern choices with the greatest support.

Anyway, best of luck to your endeavors!

[Jumpscare]

@Testament said in What stops you from running a game?:

Savage Skies on how they handled their magic system

I agree here. Savage Skies had a good magic system within the constraints of AresMUSH.

[MisterBoring]

For me it boils down to three things:

1. Poor time management skills. I probably have the time to run one, but I am so bad at managing my own time that I don’t feel like starting a game would be a good idea.

2. Lack of code knowledge. I have plenty of coding know how, but don’t know MU code at all.

3. Financial stuffs. I realize the server requirement for a MU is pretty inexpensive, but my finances are as turbulent as an airplane attempting to fly through the wall of a hurricane, so there’d be multiple times where the game would vanish just because I suddenly needed that money elsewhere.

[BloodAngel]

@Jumpscare Thank you. I will look into that!

[KarmaBum]

@Testament said in What stops you from running a game?:

The unwieldy part, and I realize it’s unwieldy, is that some spells could only be used ‘outside of combat’ because there was no way that they could be implemented into FS3. At least, not that I know of. A limitation of FS3 is you can’t buff your teammates en masse, but you can debuff opposing NPCs.

It can be done using either @Tat’s magic system or custom combat hooks. We had a lot of (busted ass) custom commands on GH, including buffs and debuffs.

I am a lousy coder and was able to figure it out enough that it worked. A good coder could probably drop in custom hooks with relative ease.