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Bailey Fork
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@Cobalt said in Macha Awareness (And Unappreciation) thread:
Could we get this split to a diff thread, tbh? The Bailey situation has nothing to do with Macha.
Upvoting this.
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@Cobalt said in Macha Awareness (And Unappreciation) thread:
Like, if I ask someone “can you send me logs” and they say “no”, I’m not going to be like “send me logs or you’re banned” – that’s coercion.
Fair point. Like I said at the time, it was less refusal and more “I’d rather not embroil the other players if it’s not a big deal”. It was clearly a bigger deal than I read from the scene.
I was going to PM you, but I don’t want to make an unwanted contact, so I’ll just say it here. 100% accept any response you offer to the below.
I’ve been doing a lot of soul searching since this happened. Both immediately after, and I’ve revisited it again. I 100% believe that communication is paramount, and it’s clear that communication here led to the situation. I don’t want to generate more drama for this, but in terms of my personal exploration of what I can do differently, I was wondering if you would be willing, if I were to send you the log of the conversation at this point (I’d do my best to redact the conversations about other games as much as I could), if you would be willing to look at it, and if you can see where it is that I went wrong in trying to explain the situation, help me to understand it?
I realize that is a big ask, and you certainly owe me nothing. And would totally understand if you say no, you don’t want to deal with this drama at all anymore. But I do want to see how I could have approached it differently, how I could have better articulated where I was, and better acted based around what I’d communicated with the other player.
Either which way, I won’t comment again on this thread (as noted) and I don’t think this really rises to the level of requiring its own thread. I’m not the one who brought me into the Macha thread, and I’m certainly more than happy to see myself out of it.
Apologies to anyone else for the eyeball burn this has caused this morning.
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@bailey said in Macha Awareness (And Unappreciation) thread:
@Cobalt said in Macha Awareness (And Unappreciation) thread:
Either which way, I won’t comment again on this thread (as noted) and I don’t think this really rises to the level of requiring its own thread.It’s not really a matter of something requiring its own thread as much as it’s now a lengthy derail of this particular thread, which it’s off-topic for. That’s almost assuredly why people assumed you were the redacted player in the Macha log, since it was in the Macha thread, and because you didn’t quote wherever you apparently got mentioned up-thread. I definitely couldn’t easily follow what situation you were replying to. (You’ve also caused yourself a bit of the Streisand Effect.)
Anyways, if admin don’t want to make a NEW thread, it could probably go into the existing Pack thread, which it’s at least mildly on-topic for.
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Referenced by
Tez
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I’d like to ask all new posters start their posts with ‘I am not Macha’ just so we can keep track.
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This is ridiculous and everyone sounds problematic here lol
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@bailey I think another one of the takeaways that might help you is to lay off the sexual comments about other characters. It sounds like they aren’t appreciated.
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@Roz said in Bailey Fork:
I’m so confused as to who Bailey is
Bailey played Bailey@ThePack; he also played Wynn@TheNetwork; he also ran Elseverse; he also played Scott Summers@Infinite Adventures. That’s as far as my knowledge goes.
But yeah, this whole thing is kinda funny.
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@Jumpscare said in Bailey Fork:
@bailey I think another one of the takeaways that might help you is to lay off the sexual comments about other characters. It sounds like they aren’t appreciated.
Yeah. Certainly sound advice. It’s not really something that I do particularly often, honestly, but easy enough to just avoid entirely so there is no misunderstanding at all.
In this particular case, what SockMonkey is referring to was a socially awkward alien character making general confused comments about humans in an attempt by me as a player to be funny, and not in any way suggestive of trying to get any sort of activity out of it for myself, but the point remains that uncomfortable things are uncomfortable.
I’d gotten a pretty decent amount of feedback for others on that scene in question that it was funny and that the humor was landing as intended, but if I had known at the time that it was causing anyone discomfort I’d have stopped immediately.
To be clear, what I was told some time later by SM (not by SM, but by SM’s player) was to stop ICly talking about the character’s sexual activities ICly because SM didn’t want to deal with the IC consequences of the character’s IC sexual activity, and none of what was mentioned above was mentioned to me at the time as the reason for the discomfort (and it had all been literally one scene several weeks prior that had never come up again), and I earnestly feel horrified that that was the impression that was conveyed. I very much did not intend for that, and will be rather careful going forward if I RP elsewhere knowing that’s what got conveyed. That is certainly something very real and very uncomfortable, and would have made far more sense to me as something objectionable; I also understand why the player would have felt less comfortable mentioning those.
I’d like to think that I could learn from my mistakes, so I do appreciate the feedback.
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@bailey Here is the thing, when someone tells you that you’re making them uncomfortable, it’s not where you go to other people to get validation about whether or not you were in the right. When you make someone uncomfortable, you apologize and you stop doing what makes them uncomfortable. You do not start explaining why you are right, and continue to do it with that person or other people. That is where I think the issue is here.
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I debated on whether or not to respond to this thread, because usually, these types of things resolve into roasts and complaints that eventually solve nothing and it gets very easy without context to demonize one player over another.
The situation as described in the reply to @jumpscare is twisted and unbalanced. The problem was not that it was one scene, the problem became that all RP eventually was twisted and angled to those types of jokes about a single specific character.
I think honestly a lot of the issue is that you get so wrapped up in the idea of what //you// feel would be interesting and dramatic that you forget it’s a cooperative setting. That RP should be fun for everyone involved. When even the players involved in that story no longer wanted to talk about it you kept pushing.
I think everyone on here has had that feeling at one point or another where they get so excited about a particular storyline that they lose sight of the bigger picture. But when you play the victim instead of really looking at and taking responsibility for your actions it gets you nowhere.
It’s sad, because you have the capability of being an amazing roleplayer I think if you could just get past the creeper tendencies.
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@Twinkle said in Bailey Fork:
@bailey Here is the thing, when someone tells you that you’re making them uncomfortable, it’s not where you go to other people to get validation about whether or not you were in the right. When you make someone uncomfortable, you apologize and you stop doing what makes them uncomfortable. You do not start explaining why you are right, and continue to do it with that person or other people. That is where I think the issue is here.
Oh, for sure. 100% agree.
Just to clarify chronology a bit here, I was receiving (unprompted) feedback from other players during the scene that they found it funny and entertaining. That’s what I was referring to above. I didn’t seek out any validation had and no idea at the time that anyone was upset by it. Everyone seemed to be enjoying the scene, and my character was just comments like “Objectively speaking, he is a rather aesthetically appealing Terran specimen.” and “You removed (your shirt) in an effort to attract the attention of females, I presumed, in a primitive display of coloration.”
It was not until several weeks later that I received any OOC comment from SM at all about anything of the RP, at which point I immediately ceased RPing with or about that character at SM’s request without argument or seeking external opinion. I even had to push off another character OOCly who brought up conversation about that character’s doings to respect that, because I wanted to make sure I was adhering to SM’s request.
Ultimately, I stopped logging into the game shortly after that conversation (not making any kind of dramatic exit or anything, I just stopped logging in) until another player pinged me on Discord and told me that they missed my RP. That’s when I made a brief return, played in a scene or two, and ultimately left because the last thing I wanted to do was make anyone uncomfortable.
I don’t really want to keep going back and forth on this, because I’ve clearly had my takeaways here and lessons to apply in the future, and I don’t want to subject anyone else to dissection this drama, but I did want to clarify that point. If someone asks me to change gears, I change gears, and I don’t ask questions as to why.
No one individual’s RP or story should ever cross into a point where it bothers another player. Period.
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@SpottedCow said in Bailey Fork:
The situation as described in the reply to @jumpscare is twisted and unbalanced. The problem was not that it was one scene, the problem became that all RP eventually was twisted and angled to those types of jokes about a single specific character.
I think honestly a lot of the issue is that you get so wrapped up in the idea of what //you// feel would be interesting and dramatic that you forget it’s a cooperative setting. That RP should be fun for everyone involved. When even the players involved in that story no longer wanted to talk about it you kept pushing.
I think that’s a fair assessment of what happened. I had not realized to what extent it was occurring or to what extent it appeared to be focused on a character, but looking back I could see how it may have gone on longer than it had to. I was playing out the role of an annoyed and over-protective father (in the context, he knew he was dying and it saddened him as much as he felt emotions (the alien race was somewhat Vulcan-like) that the man he thought would take care of his daughter after he died was turning his back on her), and probably should have just stepped back and let things die.
It was hard to detach that from the mindset of the character, although I should have sensed that and overruled that as a player for greater consideration of the other players involved. But I did as soon as it was mentioned to me OOCly.
I appreciate the comment on my RP - I’d like to think I am a decent role player, and certainly want to avoid anything resembling creeper tendencies. In this case, with the broader context of SM’s lingering discomfort from a previously floated background idea, I can totally see in hindsight how it was interpreted that way.
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@bailey Hey, while I appreciate that you are no longer @'ing them, but could you please stop bringing up SockMonkey in every one of your replies? At this point it kinda seems like you are fixated on them for some reason.
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Now that I’ve come around on the To Catch a Creeper aspect of this forum I find it hilarious every time one comes in here thinking they are going to rehab their image. Like I am sure this stuff works on randos in the MU* community but this is not the place where you’re gonna sell people on “it was just a joke bro” on sheer word count.
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Fair enough. I was just answering points that were raised, but I’m happy to see this having run its course. Last thing I want to do is cause anyone any more trauma.
I took ownership for the things I needed to take ownership for and clarified the things I wanted to clarify.
This has been fruitful in the sense that I appreciate the feedback. It helps me to understand what happened and what I can do differently in the future if I decide to continue in the hobby.
I appreciate everyone’s contributions and what they have pointed out.
Thanks, and happy MUSHing all.
Cheers.
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man, i don’t even RP anymore, but man, was that a guy who did not take ownership of his shit.
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@Meg said in Bailey Fork:
man, i don’t even RP anymore, but man, was that a guy who did not take ownership of his shit.
But @Meg, he appreciates the feedback and he’s going to work on himself.
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@Coin We done him wrong, it’s the same old song forever.
